No Audio from HDMI Out

Using Google Meet, Zoom, etc.)
wikoli32
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#11

Post by wikoli32 »

russellhltn wrote: Sun Feb 18, 2024 5:42 pm
wikoli32 wrote: Sun Feb 18, 2024 11:19 am I am finding that no HDMI out port includes audio in our chapel except the one at the pulpit.
I'm not sure as I'm understanding you. Are you looking for audio in the HDMI signal, or are you talking about a separate connector on the wall plate that has the HDMI connector?

I'm looking at the XLR panel at the top that has nothing plugged in. I'd be curious what happens if you plug the "Chapel out" to "Webcast". That may put audio on the HDMI.
I believe the ideal setup for our Zoom broadcast would be utilizing one of the "HDMI Out" ports located at the back of the chapel or at the front of the cultural hall and that this setup would supply both audio and video. This would enable myself or another clerk or technology specialist to manage the Zoom while remaining present. Until we can figure out how the AV system is setup from the FM group we will probably explore using the XLR Panel to a 3.5mm and just leaving a laptop next to the server rack or we could consider using the 'Line Out' located next to the pulpit on the rostrum, although this may not be as convenient. Leaving a laptop or iPad running the Zoom broadcast on the ground next to the pulpit and having a member of the bishopric manage the feed specifically for the Sacrament could also be a viable option.

These ideas offer flexibility and efficiency, and I'm excited to explore our options.
russellhltn
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#12

Post by russellhltn »

You might give my suggestion a try. All you need is a mic cable and a laptop to test with. If it work (audio over HDMI) that's one less cable to mess with when connecting the laptop.
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dave.swartz
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#13

Post by dave.swartz »

wikoli32,
Interesting idea of remoting the webcasting position away from the rack and instead using an output jack in the Cultural Center. This is not something that we will be doing because of the potential distraction of having equipment in the chapel. We also want to have a bit more control and access to the raw feeds by being right at the rack. I also don't have a wired network connection next to this connection.

The challenge you are having is that by default many of the remote HDMI outputs are muted. This is to prevent the TV's and projectors which have built in speakers from being heard independent from the tuned audio systems speakers. I don't see unmuting the channel as being much of a problem as long as the TV's/Projectors are muted or the volume turned off.

The challenge you may face is to get FMG and MHT to agree to unmute the HDMI connection. There are many design decisions that have been made under the assumption that users are untrained as well as to reduce the frequency of support calls. Without the right software you cannot unmute these connections.
dave.swartz
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#14

Post by dave.swartz »

Here is a more extended reply in the hope that it will be useful in helping you learn about your new system.

These are insights that we have learned over the couple of years that we have had our system. We have tried many different combinations and hookups of equipment and have finally settled on a pretty stable configuration.

1. Our installation has a connection in the rack labeled WBC. This is an audio (3.5 mm audio cable) and video connection (HDMI cable) designed to connect to a Teradek encoder. It is not exposed on the Customer Panel (CP) since the Teradek was intended to be mounted in the rack. The Teradek was the standard method for streaming to the church webcasting service or any other RTMP streaming video endpoint. With the transition from an RTMP streaming service to Zoom as the delivery platform the Teradek has been replaced with a Razer Ripsaw HD (https://www.razer.com/streaming-capture ... -ripsaw-hd) This device appears to a computer attached to it’s USB C interface as a USB 3.0 web camera. What’s nice about this device, over other simpler devices, is good flexibility with an HDMI input, an HDMI output (passthrough), as well as a separate Audio input (Mic and Aux) and onboard mixer. It also has a headphone output for monitoring. (https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... Guidelines)This device can be provided by the FMG.

2. For normal weekly meetings we feed audio from the Customer Panel (CP) Chapel Mix Out Connection and the Organ Out connection to an external mixer. This is a very simple ancient mixer that we already had. Before the meeting starts, we use this mixer to just stream the organ prelude music to our Zoom meeting, suppressing/attenuating the podium audio. This is to prevent Zoom from automatically increasing the audio gain such that the closed captioning system can decode what is being said on the stand. This is to provide a level of privacy to leaders that the normal chapel mix doesn’t provide since the system has no mute of the podium microphone. The output of the mixer can be passed to a simple sound card such as the SoundBlaster Play 3 or via USB from the mixer itself.

3. CP Mic#1 and Mic#2 appear to be a simple audio connection from matching jacks on the rostrum. Think of it as a long passive cable from the rack to the stand. This would allow us to connect Choir mics on the stand to these outputs and then pass the signal to inputs / channels on the mixer. We currently do not use them.
4. I have no idea of how Webcast In is to be used. On our system a QSC networked amplifier is used. This amplifier has audio input connections and supports connections from Webcast In, Video Switcher Left, Video Switcher Right, RS Room mic, and Children's Meeting Room mic. I am very interested if any one else is using the Webcast In connection for anything. If we need to insert audio into the system, we do it a couple of other ways, standby for details.

5. Zoom support. Using a stake provided computer we capture the video (from the Razer Ripsaw) and the Audio (from the audio mixer) and feed it into OBS studio. We do this so that we can have a predefined scene for normal broadcast and a second scene that has no audio and a static image for Sacrament meeting. Using VBAudio cable software (free) we can route the output audio from OBS to Zoom. This can also be done using an external sound card and a loopback cable. OBS has a virtual camera that Zoom, on the same computer, can use as a video source.

6. Presentation modes.
a. Speaker with laptop computer on stand. In this configuration we have a laptop computer that feeds its output HDMI signal to the input of an HDMI four port splitter. One output goes to the Extron HDMI input jack on the stand. The second output goes to the projector. From the projector audio output, we run an audio cable to the RCA input jacks on the side of the podium. Plugging the HDMI cable into the laptop will usually set the active audio playback device of the computer to be the HDMI output. We set the audio volume level of the computer to be ~ 80% of maximum. The volume level of the projector is also set to ~80% of maximum. The presenter is advised that they can control the volume using the knob on the side of the podium. This is a very intuitive control and fast to operate.

We could have used the HDMI input directly to pass audio but there are some issues. To enable this function, it must be done from the stand. The control panel also has the ability to accidentally mute the system. Fixing these issues would require the Technology Specialist (TS) to disrupt the meeting by going on the stand and access the control. The auxiliary audio input in contrast is always active. The second issue for us is that the virtual volume control on the touch screen is only really active over the top ¼ of the slider. The installer set the lower limit of the control to be much too low. A middle setting appears to the users as if it’s not working and leads to confusion.

b. Presentation coming from the control booth. In this configuration you would like to send a video to the rostrum that is separate from the video feed for broadcast. In our stake conferences the Cultural Center projector, Cultural Center displays, and Rostrum displays will show the broadcast feed. This feed will have a camera view of the speaker or the PowerPoint / video, or sometimes both. The chapel display will only show the PowerPoint/Video display as needed and idle most of the meeting on a black slide. In this case we have a computer in the back room running OBS with the appropriate scenes queued up. The output from this computer is NDI. We then have an NDI player (think Apple TV with extra software) on the stand connected to the network and the projector. The ATV replaces the laptop in configuration A. What’s nice about this configuration is that the speaker doesn’t need to fiddle with anything, they just stand up and the back room plays the presentation. This gives you a video feed separate from the building video distribution system.

7. Review: The reason for presenting sections 1-6 before the next section is to emphasize how, at least for our stake, our operator position is right at the rack. I have seen others remote all the rack outputs to a second office or room when the rack is in a horrible location. For larger events we do use the other HDMI connection that are available right at the rack.

8. No Audio from HDMI out. What I think you are looking for is the ability to connect to one of the Extron HDMI outputs such as in the front of the Cultural Center. Then using this connection setup your streaming setup at that location. I think that all the video outputs of the system are out of the box muted. This is to prevent the speaker output of the display, such as in the Cultural Center, from being heard.
dave.swartz
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#15

Post by dave.swartz »

A few questions from the pictures:
1. What amplifier is being used. I see no sign of the QSC amplifier that our system has. This is interesting since that Amplifier provides many of the audio inputs to the Core 110f.
2. Where is the Listen Technologies ALS transmitter?
3. I also don’t see the masking sound generator/amplifier for the stake and bishop’s offices.

wikoli32 could you post a more complete photo set for us of your AV system install. Camera and Rostrum as well. What company did the install?
russellhltn
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Re: No Audio from HDMI Out

#16

Post by russellhltn »

dave.swartz wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2024 1:55 pm Where is the Listen Technologies ALS transmitter?
Most likely in the sound rack.
dave.swartz wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2024 1:55 pm I also don’t see the masking sound generator/amplifier for the stake and bishop’s offices.
It may be in the sound rack, but I've also seen it in other places. The one's I've seen are small TOA half-rack width PA amps. Only looking at the back do you realize it has a built-in white noise generator.
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